[A320FAN]

Originally Posted by 642435

@ The Judge and Mars6423:
This thread is about "how can AirCanada Improve" and "Have a better cancelation policy. It's not about "how can I suck up to the airlines" - that's a different thread........

I'm not saying that you don't have a voice and should not have one. I completly support open discussion, because that's a fair and open T & C policy!!

If I was an Airline company, I would be saying that your words don't count for anything and you are not allowed to speak or say anything, unless you want to pay more than 2x the price......Sadly, by your own admition, you guys would be willing to pay. So my guess is you have lots of $$ to throw around.....

So please wake up and stop supporting unfair T & C Policies.......Wrong is wrong and it doesn't matter how you try to butter it up, it still does not make it right.....

And yes, I am a Airline supporter. I do so by suggesting how Airlines can improve their service and by showing them where they are doing things wrong.......

We all get what you are saying. The point is that Air Canada is on the
Air transport business. Ticket prices are supply
And demand. Remember you just buying/ renting
a seat on an airplane not the space shuttle.
Low to mid priced economy class tickets
will always come with certain restrictions take it or
leave it. The business flyer for the most part with yourself
Excluded need extra flexibility and therefore
are willing to pay for that privilege.

[The_Judge]

Originally Posted by 642435

This thread is about "how can AirCanada Improve" and "Have a better cancelation policy.

If that is the case, here is your initial post starting the thread.

Originally Posted by 642435

I'm the owner of a small business, every dollar counts. We purchased 3 tickets at the same time, about 2 months before having to travel. 1 month in, one of the employees left the company. Air Canada says it's "to bad, so sad". they will not refund the ticket - only the tax portion of the ticket. they will not change the name on the ticket, so that a different employee could travel. If I behaved that way with my clients, I would be out of business!!

This is another form of legal theft practiced by companies that have a monopoly on a market and the Federal Government should intervene when corporate policies are to steal from the public.

I missed the suggestion for improvement in there, unless your suggestion was for the government to intervene and if it is, I went over that in a subsequent post. It seemed more like an AC complaint posted in the wrong section. Forgive me if I'm mistaken.

[642435]

It's kinda funny that the only people that think the current T & C policy of Airlines is OK or FAIR or GOOD BUSINESS......are airline employees or ex-airline employees......

I hate to say, but you folks have been brain washed to think that current Airline policies are good and there's nothing wrong with them.

If an Airline wants to know "how can they improve", well my suggestion to them is to have a FAIR/PROPER T & C policy, more specifically in regards to ticket changes/cancelation for small businesses, where the employer forks out $$ on behalf of the employee (to do business) but the employee leaves - and therefore the employer is left holding the bag.

So probably the only thing we are going to agree on folks is to disagree.
Anyone that has gone thru our current situation will agree with me and every airline employee or ex-employee probably won't.....

I'm ok with that as I know I've done my part to try to make the world a better place and help a company improve their service.

[The_Judge]

642435, you are probably a very nice number, er, person. But it is clear you either do not comprehend or are only reading parts of what I'm writing. Here is a quote from your very last post.

"It's kinda funny that the only people that think the current T & C policy of Airlines is OK or FAIR or GOOD BUSINESS......are airline employees or ex-airline employees......"

Here is another quote from your very last post.

"I hate to say, but you folks have been brain washed to think that current Airline policies are good and there's nothing wrong with them.

Here are a couple of quotes from previous posts I have made.

"That is a known fact and nothing new here."

That was in reference to your statement that the policies stated in the terms and conditions are unfair. In fact, that was my very first sentence in this thread, agreeing with you.

"I said they weren't fair. Agreed. I am with you. We are one on that. Do you get it???"

"I agree with everything you say up until that last paragraph. And I partially agree with that."

"Your argument I agreed with, the t and c's are unfair. Agreed but they aren't going to change."

I agreed with you on 4 separate occasions. If you're going to debate a point, 1/2 the process is listening and comprehending.

[jimworcs]

Things can be done to make change, but it does require political will. I am not convinced that passengers or the public confront politically the unfairness they face on a daily basis from airlines. Although I think she is a nut, Kate Hanni did succeed in getting the rules changed about airlines holding passengers hostage, often without food, water or access to toilets. It took persistence, political engagement and lobbying every bit as effective as the airlines own lobbying efforts.

In Europe, despite screaming from airlines which predicted widespread bankrupty, unfair competition with non-EU carriers and disaster, the protections were considerably strengthened for passengers travelling on flights which originate or arrive in Europe. It can be done. Not sure what happens in Canada, but unless someone is lobbying parliament, nothing will change.

Airlines control a vital part of the infrastructure of the nation. The air traffic system in the US enjoys massive public subsidy. They are protected from competition and enjoy special ownership rights and enjoy anti-trust immunity. They have been allowed to form mega-mergers, driving a coach and horses through monopoly regulation. Their priviledges allow them to abuse passengers. It is time a new balance was struck and that with these rights there should be responsibilities. The US model is broken and it needs to be fixed. In bad years, the airlines lose huge sums of money, file bankruptcy and start over....leaving investors and employees empty handed, and customers are royally screwed. The only winners are the fat cat managers.

Wake up and smell the coffee America.

[642435]

@ The Judge: I'm sorry; I didn't explain myself properly in my last post. We both agree the T & C is unfair and so on; no issue....What we don't agree on is the method in which to resolve/fix it.

Your approach is to do nothing and just pay the much, much higher fee.
My approach is to tell the airlines their T & C is wrong and is equivalent to theft. My approach is also about complaining to the media and politicians if required to right the wrongs of Airlines.

As I mentioned before, this thread is about "How can AirCanada Improve".
So my suggestion to them is to have a better T & C policy - one that is fair and honest. "That" is a good method to improve service to clients for AirCanada. Paying the 2.2x higher ticket price, is "not".

@ Jimworcs: Excellent Post. You are correct. If people behave like sheep, then they will get fleeced (of their money). People need to get together and puch companies to correct their wrongs. Otherwise the other solution is people will push their politicians to get it done.

[markmogel]

Originally Posted by jimworcs

Things can be done to make change, but it does require political will. I am not convinced that passengers or the public confront politically the unfairness they face on a daily basis from airlines. Although I think she is a nut, Kate Hanni did succeed in getting the rules changed about airlines holding passengers hostage, often without food, water or access to toilets. It took persistence, political engagement and lobbying every bit as effective as the airlines own lobbying efforts.

A nut? Perhaps. But the story behind why those tarmac rules were enacted is due to one of the most extraordinary propaganda campaigns ever perpetrated. And it was done by just a couple of people. There's a book about it; Diverted:High Flyers and Frequent Liars.

[jimworcs]

There is indeed a book about it.....written by someone called Mark Mogel!!!!

[Survivor]

All is well and fine as long as any politically initiated airfare rules solution applies to all carriers flying in and out of the country that sets the rules. Sounds a lot like the situation Canadians got them selves out of when they were mesmerized as the USA thought deregulation was so wonderful (160 airlines defunct since then). So.... if REGULATION would solve the problem.. so be it! All will be rosie and just.